Some Sack Sagas Involving Thomas, Ellis
Published: Wed, September 17, 2008 - 7:16pm EDT
By Randy Lange
Lange is editor-in-chief of newyorkjets.com. He covered the Jets for 13 years for The Record of Hackensack, N.J.
File Under: Thomas Jones, Shaun Ellis, Bryan Thomas, Sione Pouha, Mark Gastineau, Matt Cassel
09/17 — When Bryan Thomas was talking with reporters the other day about his fast start out of the box, D-linemate Sione Pouha sat a few lockers to his right saying sotto voce "Sackmaster ... Sackmaster."
"That's not the way I look at it," Thomas told me today about his start.
No, BT is an expressly humble guy who wants to do a good job and help his team. He knows last year's production wasn't up to his 2006 campaign, so he redoubled his efforts this past off-season.
And what has resulted, at least for the first two games of this season, is Sackmaster.
Thomas already has three sacks, after notching just 2.5 all last season. Two of those drops came against Chad Pennington in the opener, and he got No. 3 Sunday vs. New England when, as part of a five-man rush, he got past TE David Thomas (no relation to Bryan, nor to the founder of Wendy's) and grabbed Matt Cassel from behind as the first-time NFL starter was stepping up and away from a mammoth swat from NT Kris Jenkins.
If three sacks in the first two games of the season sounds like a lot for the Jets, well, it is. Thomas is in fact tied for second place in the NFL, one sack behind former teammate John Abraham, who has four sacks for the Falcons.
And consider this: Abraham, in his six Jets seasons, never got off to the start that Thomas has this year. In fact, the last time a Green & White defender had three sacks after two games, it was DE Shaun Ellis in 2003.
And the last Jet who had more after two games? That would be Mark Gastineau, who had that four-sack game at Indianapolis to open his historic 1984 season.
More Joy of Sacks
As former official Jerry Markbreit might've said, "Upon further review ... "
Upon further review of a play in the Jets-Pats game, Ellis now has two sacks in two games, and the Jets have eight sacks for the season, tied for second in the league with Tennessee, one behind league leader Seattle's nine.
The play in question was Cassel's run down the line of scrimmage midway through the second quarter, at the end of which Ellis got a hold of the Patriots QB's facemask.
The grasp was unfortunate, but it had nothing to do with the play, which was ruled a run for zero yards but, because Cassel motioned as if to pass and then tucked and scrambled, should have been ruled a sack for zero yards. And today Elias Sports Bureau changed that ruling to a sack.
It doesn't take any of the sting out of the Jets' 19-10 defeat. But it did signal an earlier start to the Jets' strong midgame pressure than first recognized. Beginning with that play, Cassel was sacked four times in a span of seven dropbacks.
Ellis, Thomas, et al., will try to keep up their sack pace Monday night against the Chargers and Philip Rivers, who's been dropped only twice so far this season.
Some Eye Muffs
CBS had some confusions in its Sunday telecast. Five minutes into the game, Jim Nantz was talking about New England's recent dominance when he issued this statement:
"See the history between these two. New England with a 20-game win streak in the regular season — it's the longest regular-season win streak in the history of the league."
It's true that the Patriots came into the game with an NFL regular-season record of 20 consecutive victories, but he wasn't talking about the Jets-Patriots series. As one-sided as it's been lately, the Jets had lost seven in a row (now eight) at home to the Pats and two straight at Gillette Stadium.
And in the third quarter, the network had some switching problems that resulted in a complete miss of the first play of the Jets' series that began with 6:20 to play on a Brett Favre incompletion for Laveranues Coles. No mention was made of the missed play, which leads me in my suspicious mind to think: Would any baseball telecast that missed a pitch during the pennant drives not profusely apologize for the error?
Fans Respond
Here's your chance to tell Randy what you think! Add a Comment | Hide All Show All (52)BIG AL Said:
Wed, September 17, 2008 - 7:45pm EDT"not to mention that no call for pass interferance on farve to cotchery for big yards, it seem that for some reason NE gets away with big penaltys we get hit for 15 on that bump with cassel but adalius thomas manhandels farve for ten yds no call if that would have been any jet on cassel we would have got 15 i just dont know its all the time with NE the last paragraph says to me it smells fishy"
BIG AL Said:
Wed, September 17, 2008 - 7:57pm EDT"i would also like to say great job on defense congrats BT for a great start and hopefully we add to those sacks with rivers eating the turf as i stated earlier they need this W these losses can come back to haunt later and the way the BILLS steped up they seem to have momentum grant it we have a tight 3 gm bump we get out of SD we have the cards maybe 3-1 with 6 out of 8 we could be 9-3 in DEC"
BIG AL Said:
Wed, September 17, 2008 - 8:03pm EDT"so if they stay the course and step on some throats we could go in DEC with 4 wins that spliting the bills series and be looking real hot but only if the TEAM gets on the same page so drews 10-6 11-5 is realistic but again they need to make the statement MONDAY they once again have the stage lets see how they perform GO J-E-T-S "
Ira Said:
Wed, September 17, 2008 - 8:04pm EDT"Randy, Yes its nice to see BT get off to a great start. Besides him picking up his play having Pace on the other side also helps. This defense overall is going to continue to grow and get better each week. I said it would be a top 10 D this year. At this pace maybe a top 5. GO JETS!!!!"
Rich Said:
Wed, September 17, 2008 - 8:20pm EDT"another fuax pas by the ref was the spot on the sack of Bret Favre by Thomas. The replay would show that Thomas grabbed his jersey and started whirling him around, that started on the 13 yard line and by the time Favre fell to the ground he was on the 8 yard line where they spotted the ball" "
Michael Said:
Wed, September 17, 2008 - 8:25pm EDT"hey randy am i seeing this right is the cummings LB on our practice squid i probly spelled that wrong.Jets fan for life,Michael"
Randy Lange Said:
"Michael, LB Kenwin Cummings has been signed to the Jets practice squad."
Jay Said:
Wed, September 17, 2008 - 8:31pm EDT"I agree Al. I get angrier at these unspoken biases than when a ref simply blows a call. Example, Mike Carey blows call NYJ vs Cleveland when Baker is pushed out (it happens). Yet the Patriots (whose clutch and grab style forced the league into changing the defensive holding/pass interference rules) still never get called for defensive penalties. Like NBA- Jordan never called for traveling"
mike ex jet fan Said:
Wed, September 17, 2008 - 8:57pm EDT"some 1 set my alarm clock please cause I must be sleeping ------- am I the only 1 that listens to manginis interviews 0n sny ??????? all he ever talks about teams up next --- knows how g8 all the players are how g8 all the coaches are-- sounds like hes interviewing 4 his next job or leaving his options open . shouldn't he use the time to talk about our team & when or how hes gonna fix it ---"
Jesse Said:
Wed, September 17, 2008 - 9:00pm EDT"Great article Randy! BT does look great so far this year, the front 7 looks great so far! If the jets keep it up on D we might have 4 or 5 pro bowlers! You're right about the calls though it wasn't just this game but the last game we had some questionable calls. The pass to JC was clearly not a pass interference, he was going for the ball."
JP Said:
Wed, September 17, 2008 - 11:09pm EDT"The Jet D is back. If we pick it up better against the pass we are in great shape. As for the Jet haters commentating the game, with that new Sports "emporium" built in Boston, The Pats have CBS in their back pocket so it comes as no surprise. As for the clock debacle, I don't know how that was blown but every second counts. I also agree with Big Al on the penalties."
Jesse Said:
Wed, September 17, 2008 - 11:42pm EDT"The next game is going to be tough! That O-Line only gave up 2 sacks to our 5 so far! Hope the jets look to keep 2 guys blocking S.Phillips and 2 guys on A.Gates. They r going to come out playing us with anger after those last 2 games, but our team should be play even angrier than them! That lost to the pats and the 4-12 season last yr. this is going to be a shoot out!"
Pete Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 12:34am EDT"BT is off to a great start. He's really proving me wrong. Jenkins has been an absolute stud and overall D looks very good. It looks like we struck gold again in the 4th rd. It's funny when you look at the absolute dichotomy of Mangini and Herm. Herm had such a poor football IQ and made in game mistakes obvious to a novice. My 13yr old would turn to me and ask me why he didn't call a time out."
Pete Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 12:39am EDT"It's amazing he won at all with Cottrell as DC. Say what you want about him, but his players loved him and they always played hard. He was a poor technician but great leader and motivator. Mangini has such a high football IQ and structured gameplan yet lacks the leadership qualities to run a team as he does without the wins to back it. It's like a controlled experiment. IQ vs heart."
jet80 Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 1:16am EDT"Favre needs Clowney back asap,does anybody know anything about his return?hope Keller makes some noise against SD"
Ira Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 7:03am EDT"Well if fans are worried about refs blowing or mising calls wait until Monday night this week. The Chargers will probably get every call or non-call there is to make up for last week. Regardless of that the Jets will still come out and play a strong game against one of the worst defensive teams in the league right now. Tough game ahead but the Jets can win if they bring their A game. GO JETS!!!!"
uncle joe Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 8:02am EDT"Great article Randy as always.Do we have more sacks than the Giants?So 5th against the run,3rd in sacks,(and we didnt get to the BYE YET )when is Mangini gonna turn this team around?The refs couldve called NE for holding on every play in that game.It was like playing Madden with the penalties off!"
Pranit Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 8:14am EDT"agree with you Mike. Mangini would make even Kansas city sound like they are unbeatable and thats what he pretty much is saying about every other team. So what if chargers are explosive? When will the Jets be able to beat (very) good teams? or will we get our 6 wins this yr over miami, KC etc...Mangini -- your job is to make the Jets beat Indy, NE & chargers. Don't say & think we can't beat them.."
Zartan Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 9:11am EDT"Someone mentioned that the Jets big Prob was the OC. thought long and hard & have to say i agree 100%. never ever liked the jets playcalling. but this team should play better than this against top notch talent. cant wait around for bad teamsso we can to play tuff. Edit that playbook!!!!!"
Ira Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 10:11am EDT"UncleJoe, The turn around after the bye week this year will be with the offense.Everybody read Kirwin's article on NFL.Com today. Clearly the stats show that Favre is not on the same page yet. And how could he after only 5 weeks. Things will get going more this Monday night but expect much more of Favre after the bye week."
MikeMc Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 10:29am EDT"Drew your right ,people are jumping off left & right, Good Riddance!!Hey Mike(the EXjetfan)Mangini is the same guy win or lose, do you want him to have a Mora/ D.Green meltdown?Row you have to judge all the games in Mangini's time here ,no cherry picking. Bottom line is he's building a winner longterm& its week#2,JETFAN for life -win or lose, if thats not your Mantra your an opportunistic poser!!!"
Vince Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 10:40am EDT"Fantastic article Randy, Bryan Thomas is finally living up to wearing #99! Mark Gastineau was a beast, probably the greatest pass rusher I've ever seen along with Lawrence Taylor and Reggie White. I'm a little disappointed with our defensive line as a whole except for BT. I thought the Jets should retire #99 for Mark but if BT is going to keep playing like this, I say wait to retire it for now."
MikeMc Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 10:41am EDT"IRA, right on , I've been saying all along this will take time for our offense to get rolling , if we can win some games along the way we have an opportunity to make a Nov/Dec run to the playoffs and maybe beyond.Alot of fans think players just line up & play, but that is clearly not the case its the ultimate team sport & everyone has to play as a well oiled unit to be successful, we'll be fine."
Ken Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 10:55am EDT"Guys. Like I said we wanted MANGINI because we wanted to COPY Belichick system. Mangini was Belichick right hand man. What we want from MANGINI is to get the EXECUTION on GAME DAY from the Jets players! That is the PROBLEM! What makes the PATS so great is that they always (EXECUTE) on game day. And the problem with the Jets is they always have an EXCUSE & say we have to correct our mistakes."
scjoe Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 11:06am EDT"I see what other Jet fans here are saying, but be patient, the pieces are in place,if we can get to the bye week 2-2 we will be fine, Clowney should be back, Brett should have a better grasp of the offense and Keller should be up to speed. Now, just get Washington more involved and watch out AFC! As for the D, it will get better and better.Don't get to down on EM, he will get it done."
BIG AL Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 11:18am EDT"wow Ira that thought didnt even cross my mind it will be interesting to see how the officials handle this game. i just hope the jets are smart enough to play as era free as they can i know thats cheesey but they do have 60 tough minutes to play this game and mangini need to let farve run this offense because SD is letting the dogs loose and he also need to tone down the drama of all our oponents"
Drew Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 11:26am EDT"Now that everyone has taken a deep breath we have to realize we are goin on the to road to play a tough SD team. I think we can win this game but it is not a must win. I know Favre and some players said that but the must win is next week if we lose on Monday night. We need to be 2-2 at the Bye and then go on a run. We need to go into SD and put doubt into that fragile team early hang on for a win"
uncle joe Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 11:30am EDT"Can we vote to get Ira on JetsNation on SNY to replace Lucas?"
Drew Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 11:31am EDT"If anyone thinks we got hosed last week on the calls just watch the show the refs pull on Monday night. We will not get one call all night. The NFL wants the Chargers to do well and the know they stole a win from them last week in Denver. We will need to put points up early and often to win this game. That defense is bad. "
Anthony Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 11:36am EDT"I agree, I think that they can beat anyone. They just need to gain that mean edge that all these other teams seem to have. I think we can beat any team. We should have definitely beat N.E. there was a BOGUS CALL. That really got me upset and I believe in our runnign game to but I also believe in Brett Favre. I think the OL should take this as an insult and next time we play N.E. Bury them"
Jesse Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 11:49am EDT"I don't know Ira, I'm expecting to see some things from Favre on mon. Stuckey, Coles, and Keller are slowly starting to get into the action a little more. We always play San Diego hard and Favre has never lost to San Diego. P.Rivers is real accurate, but throws a lot of low balls + no LT. LT beat us last time with 4TDs.I think we come up big on both sides of the ball! "
mike ex jet fan Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 12:31pm EDT"just want 2 say 2 the fans here I am not a hater & think I will bleed green & white 4ever god help me -- also think mangini deserved a chance as every1 does so did herm kotite -- on that note mangini is on his 3th year now right --- & 2 the fan that said the hc has nothing to do with spotty shottys play calling really !!!!! guess I'm right then --- he has no control or no glue"
Ira Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 12:43pm EDT"Good show this week with Eric Allen,T-Rich and Leon as their quest. Heard Phil Simms today and he said he had no problem with the Jets running it 3 times at the goaline. He felt if you can't make 1 yd you don't deserve to win. The problem he felt was that they would have gonwe for it on 4th and probably pass it but they got pushed back to the 4 yd line so they had to kick the FG."
tom Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 1:02pm EDT"randy i found out the hofstra lease ends october 1st "
Ira Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 1:34pm EDT"Jesse,The Jets will score pts this week. The Chargers D has been awful so far this year. They have given up 587 yds, 5 TD's and a 64.8 comp rate vs the pass and 143.5 yds per game with a 5.4 per carry avg vs the run. MNF has been good to Favre and the Jets will open it up more this week. Keller must get involved this week. Plus if he does it opens it up for the other WR's."
Ray Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 1:56pm EDT"First thing to check out monday night will be the head official, if it is Ed Hochule or however the hell he spells it, we are done. That guy has blown calls like that for years it is just the first time he has been exposed. And mike ex jet fan, yes you are the only one listening to those, do you really think your gonna get good info out an interview like that? BTW when is a 3th year?! Ha!"
Drew Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 2:19pm EDT"Ira....That was my only problem with the 3 runs at the goalline. I wanted to drive it in running the ball. My problem was I would have went for it on 4th down. Even if we dont get in we totally change field position. "
Victor Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 2:30pm EDT"Randy, When the ball carrier runs out of bounds, the clock stops only in the last 2 minutes of the half or the last 5 minutes of the game. In any other "out-of-bounds" situation, the clock is restarted once the umpire sets the football on the field. This rule was changed some time ago to speed up the game."
Randy Lange Said:
"Victor, you are correct. I withdraw my criticism of CBS and apologize for forgetting that rule."
JP Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 3:11pm EDT"Jets can be 3-1 by the bye and in great shape."
Drew Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 3:14pm EDT"Everyone seems to forget that Mangini went 10-6 and took an overmatched team to the playoffs in 06. He beat a good Tenn,GB and an awesome NE team all on the road to the playoffs. Last year ws a bad year...No question. Now we are at week 2 and everyone is a critic of this coach?? At the end of the year alot of people will owe Mangini an apology."
Ira Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 3:21pm EDT"Drew, I understand your point but once they got pushed back to the 4 yd line they had no choice. They needed to take the points at that point in the game. "
mike ex jet fan Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 3:34pm EDT"ok ready 4 my next observation on the jets --- draft picks oh & we had many over the years gonna be kind here 80 % busts -- well untill we trade them then they show there skills hmmm - so hey I have a g8 Idea lets spend 140 million on players to rich 2 have the fire in there bellys anymore-- the concept of a team is to build though the draft & develop them into winners "
J.M. Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 3:48pm EDT"After all the money spent and the addition of a three time MVP, our offense should be able to dominate. The lack of points and the failure to execute, it all comes down to coaching"
Row Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 4:27pm EDT"Drew, I agree with you on some points, but the playoff year was a fluke. We were about to lose to the Dolphins. Leon had a huge critical punt return and then a dump pass he almost took to the house. I just think that going several games last year without a offensive TD and the low scoring this year, something should be done. 2008 PF 30 PA 33 That's not right, that's not JETS football. "
BIG AL Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 6:55pm EDT"mike the X JET I FEEL YA BABE BUT YOU HAVE TO LET GO YOU LOVE THE JETS JUST TAKE IT EASY YOUR ALREADY IN THE FUTURE WE HAVE 4 DAYS TILL MON RELAX WE WILL BE FINE LOOK AT THERE GAMES ITS ALL GOOD THESE GUYS NEED AND WANT THERINGS BEFORE THERE EXIT SO DONT KID YOURSELF GO JETS"
Denzil Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 7:14pm EDT"This whole situation boils down to coaching. Eric and staff need to make some major adjustments or this season is over before it even starts. Randy, I was at the Hoosier Dome when Gastineau sacked I think it was Mike Pagel 4 times in the season opener of the '84 season. What a game that was, and what a year Gastineau had, unbelievable! GO JETS!"
mike ex jet fan Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 7:56pm EDT"unclec joe - mikeMc- about your comments no disrespect intended -- about us fans that dont agree with your outlook .--I like u use 2 say all the right things we will get better give the coach a chance 2 do his job going to be g8 -- well 40years later-- don;t know how long your guys are fans -but me I had it -- sorry guys talk 2 me at the seasons end -- please prove me wrong ."
Xavion Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 10:38pm EDT"First I want to say our major problem is the coaching or playcalling. We have waaaaaay too much talent on offense to not put up more points or at least cause more problems why is Dustin Keller Not causing the matchup problems He was supposed to cause. Why is Leon not doing the same? With all the pass rushers we have why not use more complex blitz packages. That sack can come from anywhere."
Giovanni Said:
Thu, September 18, 2008 - 11:01pm EDT"Speaking of sacks... what is going on with our 1st round pick Vernon Gholston. Is he going to get a chance to start or what? in my opinion we should have him start on the line along with Jenkins and Ellis and if B.T is going to be on the line with those two then start Gholston at outside linebacker alongside Harris, Pace, and Barton. What do you think Randy?"
Vince Said:
Fri, September 19, 2008 - 2:21pm EDT"Randy, is there anyway I can obtain some old footage of the Sack Exchange? I saw the history of the Jets dvd and the great stuff on the website here but is there anywhere that I can get some Gastineau and Klecko footage on dvd or vhs?"
Randy Lange Said:
"Vince, I don't know the easy answer to that. We don't have any DVDs other than the recently released history DVD. Perhaps NFL Films has something you're looking for?"
Steve Said:
Sat, September 20, 2008 - 6:25pm EDT"Hi Randy, what is going on with Gholston? Why haven't we seen more of him. Is he just not on the field or is he not making any plays? Another question, is Woody Johnson going to retire Mark Gasitneau's jersey next? I think his jersey needs to be retired and so many people want to see that happen. Thanks Randy!"
christian Said:
Tue, September 23, 2008 - 4:24pm EDT"The Jets defense looks pathetic. They should be ashamed of how they played San Diego. Even when they rallied in the 4th the chargers made them look like little kids. "
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Eric Said:
Wed, September 17, 2008 - 7:41pm EDT"Great Article... I was watching the game and i also found myself pondering why the clock started when clearly our players were getting out of bounds that should really be looked into"
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